MS. LAMP: Your Honor, the People call Denise Altemose to the stand.
THE COURT: How do you spell that last name?
MS. LAMP: I believe you spell it A-l-t-e-m-o-s-e.
THE COURT: Stop and raise your right hand. Do you solemnly swear or affirm the testimony you will give in this matter will be the truth, so help you God?
DR. ALTEMOSE: I do.
THE COURT: Come on around and watch your step coming up. That chair is on rollers, so be careful. The microphone or microphones aren’t going to make you any louder, so make sure you speak up loudly and distinctly for us. Tell us your full name.
THE WITNESS: Denise Lynette Altemose.
THE COURT: How do you spell Lynette?
THE WITNESS: L-y-n-e-t-t-e.
THE COURT: And your last name please?
THE WITNESS: A-l-t-e-m-o-s-e.
THE COURT: Thank you very much. Miss Lamp?
MS. LAMP: Thank you, Your Honor.
DENISE
LYNETTE ALTEMOSE, DVM
Called at 1:15 a.m. by the People, sworn by the court, testified:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MS. LAMP:
Q. Dr. Altemose, what is your profession?
A. I’m a field veterinarian.
Q. And how long have you been that?
A. For six years.
Q. And are you licensed in that same capacity?
A. Yes.
Q. And did you go through any schooling to become such?
A. I went through veterinary school.
Q. Okay. And where did you do that?
A.
The
Q. Okay. And I assume you obviously graduated.
A. Yes.
Q. Yes. Did you have any additional training after that?
A. No, I did not.
Q. Okay. And how, how many years experience overall do you have as a veterinarian?
A. Fourteen.
MS. LAMP: Okay. And I would just at this time, Your Honor, move to qualify her as an expert witness in the field of veterinary medicine, field veterinary medicine.
THE COURT: What is field veterinary medicine?
THE WITNESS: I work for the Department of Agriculture so I’m actually out on farms and in the field rather than administrative or office type position.
THE COURT: Okay. Gentlemen, do you have any questions of Dr. Altemose?
MR. DUNGAN: I just have a couple of questions, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Sure.
VOIR DIRE EXAMINATION (At 1:16 p.m.)
BY MR. DUNGAN:
Q. So you’ve been a field vet for the Department of Agriculture for six years?
A. That’s right.
Q. Which means you actually do go out to farms similar as to what you did in this case?
A. Well, we go out to all different types of agriculture operations, different types of farms, yes.
Q. In the six years that you’ve been doing that for the Department of Agriculture, how many times have you gone to a horse farm?
A. I would estimate probably three or four.
Q. Per year?
A. No. Total.
Q. Total. So this is the third or fourth time?
A. Correct.
Q. That you’ve gone to a horse farm for an investigation?
A. Correct.
Q. And prior to your six year employment with the Department of Agriculture, what did you do for a living that was veterinarian related?
A. I was a veterinarian in private practice.
Q. Where at?
A.
Q.
Who did you work for in
A.
Q. Okay. What kind of practice was that?
A. Small animal practice.
Q. So you guys didn’t deal with horses.
A. No.
Q. During the entire time that you were in private practice as a veterinarian, did you treat a horse?
A.
Yes. In the first clinic where I
worked in
Q. How many times?
A. Oh, probably ten to twelve times.
Q. In what period of time?
A. That would have been over approximately a three to four year period.
Q.
And then none once you came to
A. Correct.
Q. Okay. And then as a field vet with the Department of Agriculture, you don’t treat at all anymore, do you?
A. That’s right. We do not.
Q. You just make recommendations.
A. Correct.
THE COURT: Just a minute.
MR. DUNGAN: What happened?
THE COURT: Spider man.
MR. HURST: Window washer.
THE COURT: Suddenly. I guess I can handle it. Go ahead.
MR. DUNGAN: Are we still waiting for Spiderman?
THE COURT: No, you can go ahead.
MR. DUNGAN: I’m probably the only one in the room that can’t see it.
BY MR. DUNGAN:
Q. What else do you do as a field vet besides make field visits?
A. Well, we do TB testing of cattle, we visit pet shops to do inspections, we follow up on complaints either at pet shops or if it’s a livestock related issue such as people who aren’t burying their dead animals properly, so it’s a wide range of things that we do.
MR. DUNGAN: All right. Thank you, Your Honor. I don’t have any other questions relative to her qualifications.
MR. HURST: No, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Okay. We’ll allow the doctor to testify in this area of veterinary medicine. Miss Lamp?
MS. LAMP: Thank you, Your Honor.
CONTINUED DIRECT EXAMINATION (At 1:19 p.m.)
BY MS. LAMP:
Q.
Dr. Altemose, did you have occasion to respond to the horse farm located
at
A. Yes, I did.
Q. And how did you come to go to that farm?
A. The Michigan Department of Agriculture, Animal Industry Division, received a phone call from Animal Control Officers Wheaton and Dunlap requesting that someone come out to evaluate the horses at that facility.
Q. And when did you do that?
A. When did we do the evaluation?
Q. Yes.
A. On March twentieth.
Q. Okay. And did anybody go with you?
A. Yes. One of our other field veterinarians, Dr. Vicki Chickering, Animal Control Officers Wheaton and Dunlap, and a Jackson County Sheriff’s officer, Officer Deering.
Q. And what were your observations there at the farm on that day?
A. Well, we evaluated the animals, the horses that were there, and we also evaluated the general conditions of the property and the facilities where the animals were being housed.
Q. Okay. And did any concerns jump to your attention as a result of that overall evaluation?
A. Yes, there were concerns.
Q. I’m sorry?
A. There were concerns.
Q. Okay. What were your primary concerns?
A. The body condition of the animals in general. There were some animals which were very thin or low body condition scores, the facilities themselves were in poor condition, there were dangerous objects in the pasture areas where the horses were being housed that they could injure themselves. There was a lack of shelter for animals housed outside.
Q. And do you recall seeing a dead horse in a trailer on that day?
A. Yes, I did.
Q. Okay. And what if any observations did you make about that?
A. Well, having a dead horse in a trailer was kind of unusual. You wouldn’t keep a dead animal in a trailer like that, and it appeared that it had been dead for a little while.
Q. When you say a little while, what do you mean by that? Hours, days, weeks?
A. At least probably a week based on what it looked like.
Q. And what were the indications that would lead you to that conclusion?
A. Well, the, there were areas on the–-
MR. DUNGAN: We’ll stipulate the horse was dead for a week.
THE COURT: She’s looking at the conditions.
MR. DUNGAN: No, I’m saying we’ll stipulate it was dead for a week, if that’s the issue.
MS. LAMP: It’s not the issue, Your Honor. I’d like to know what it is that led her to that opinion.
THE COURT: Go ahead. I understood what you were saying.
MS. LAMP: Thank you, Your Honor.
THE WITNESS: There were areas on the body that appeared to have been chewed on by some type of animal, areas that appeared to be decomposed, the eyeballs were dried out and kind of withdrawn into the eye sockets.
BY MS. LAMP:
Q. Okay. And how many horses did you observe there on the farm on that day?
A. Sixty-nine live horses.
Q. Okay.
A. The dead horse and a dead foal.
Q. So two dead horses and sixty-nine live.
A. Correct.
Q. And were they separated in any way?
A. The horses were divided into several pasture areas and some horses were housed in the barn.
Q. And how many were inside the barn, if you know?
A. There were eleven horses in the barn.
Q. And that would make fifty-eight on the outside of the barn?
A. That’s right.
Q. Okay. Can you explain the BCS scale, or body condition scale?
A. Yes. The body condition scale is a nine point scale which is used to evaluate the condition of a horse based on how much body fat is on their body and you evaluate different areas primarily over bony areas of the body to see if those bony areas are visible or if there is indeed a fat cover there so that they would not be visible.
Q. Okay. And does it matter how you score the horse? For example whether you touch or not touch the horse?
A. It can make a difference. If you just look at the horse versus if you would actually touch the horse, yes.
Q. And why would there be a difference?
A. Well, depending on maybe how much fat was there, when you actually feel the horse you could tell a difference in thickness which you might not be able to judge when you just are looking at the horse.
Q. And would the winter coat factor in there as well?
A. Yes. With a winter coat you may not be able to tell that an animal is thin, whereas if you put your hand on it, then you would be able to feel the bony structures that you might not be able to see because of a longer coat.
Q. Let me ask you. If you were to eyeball the horse and give it a body score as opposed to touching the horse and giving a body score, would there, if there were, if there were an inaccuracy or a less accurate conclusion that you would come to, would it tend to move the body score up or move the body score down?
A. If you were just looking at the animal and it had a longer coat, you may judge the body condition score higher than if you actually touched the animal.
Q. Okay.
THE COURT: Is this the Henneke thing? Henneke scale?
MR. DUNGAN: Henneke.
THE COURT: Henneke. Is that the Henneke scale?
THE WITNESS: I do not know the name of the scale. I have a chart here which I use.
THE COURT: We’re trying to get a spelling. How do you spell that? Do you know how to spell that, Jennifer?
MS. LAMP: I’ve got a chart here too.
THE COURT: Just want to spell it for the record.
MS. LAMP: I don’t know if mine says the… oh, it does.
THE COURT: No, just read it off.
MS. LAMP: H-e-n-n-e-k-e.
THE COURT: You got it? All right. Sorry about that, Doctor.
BY MS. LAMP:
Q. Dr. Altemose, when you were there at the farm on that day, was it your understanding that you were there to treat the horses or to evaluate the entirety of the situation?
A. My understanding is we were there to evaluate the entirety of the situation.
Q. Okay. And as a field veterinarian, do you normally treat animals or is that something special to what you do that you evaluate? I just don’t know the answer to that.
A. As a field veterinarian, no, we do not treat animals. We would come out and evaluate a situation and then make recommendations.
Q. Okay. And did you do an eyeball body scoring of the animals at the farm?
A. Yes, we did.
Q. Okay. And could you describe what you came up with as a result of that?
A. There were three horses which were classified as body condition score one, and there were about a group of eight to ten horses which would be in the two to three range, and the remaining horses four to five.
Q. Okay. And one is very poor, nine is obese?
A. That’s right. One would be emaciated, nine would be obese.
Q. Okay. And could you describe the types of horses that were together in the pasture?
A. In the large pasture?
Q. Yes.
A. It was a mixed group of horses. There were various ages of horses there, different sexes of horses there, some pregnant mares, some which appeared to be maybe not pregnant mares.
Q. Were there differences in the body score of the horses in that pasture as well?
A. Yes.
Q. And approximately how many were in that larger pasture?
A. How many animals total?
Q. Yes.
A. In that pen there would have been forty-nine horses.
Q. Okay. And was there another outdoor pasture then?
A. Yes. There was a group of the three most emaciated horses were together in a pen, and then there was another group of six horses outside.
Q. Can you describe the condition of the pasture please?
A. The pasture was bare soil with manure. It didn’t appear to have any grass covering on it. There were broken down wire fences throughout the pasture. There was a shelter area in the pasture which was damaged, was gone on part of it. The pasture was to the north of the barn and kind of sloped downhill toward a stream which runs north of the, a stream which runs north of the barn as well.
Q. Okay. And could you describe the quality of the hay?
A. The hay appeared to be a poor quality hay that was in the pastures.
Q. And could you describe what you mean by poor quality?
A. Well, it didn’t appear to have very many leaves on the stems of the hay itself which is what you might expect for something that’s better quality. The stems were very course, almost like sticks, and there were also leaves from oak trees mixed in with the hay.
Q. Do you normally see leaves mixed in with hay?
A. Not a good quality hay.
Q. Okay. And were there a lot of leaves mixed in the hay that you saw?
A. Yes, there were.
Q. Okay. Did you observe any water tanks there on the farm on the day you were there?
A. Yes.
Q. And could you describe that please?
A. There was one water tank which did have some water but it had a thin coat of ice over the top of it. There was another water tank which was, did not have any liquid water in but had some broken pieces of ice in it. There were other tanks which I don’t know if they were being used for water or not, but they were also empty.
Q. Okay. And did the horses appear to be using any of the water tanks?
A. It did not appear that they were based on the ice on the top of it.
Q. And could you describe the shelters that you observed there at the farm?
A. The shelters were not adequate size for the number of horses which were there. One shelter in the pasture. The roof was gone from part of it and in the pen where the three most emaciated horses were the shelter was too small to accommodate all the horses.
Q. And what if anything can you tell us about the dead foal that you saw there on the property on that day?
A. The foal appeared to have been born fairly recently and looked to be close to a full term foal.
Q. And could you tell if it was a live birth?
A. I could not tell that.
Q. Okay. Moving into the barn. Could you describe the conditions inside the barn?
A. There was a lot of debris and trash in the barn. Parts of the barn made out of corrugated tin were damaged and had sharp edges on them. Some of the boards used around the stalls where the horses were, were broken down with sharp edges on them also. The pen where the nine horses in the barn were standing had pieces of wood in it, deep manure that they were walking in.
Q. Was there any bedding in that particular--
A. No, there was not.
Q. Okay. And should there have been?
A. In my opinion, yes.
Q. Did you notice a bay mare in the pen?
A. Yes.
Q. And what was it about the bay mare that you noticed?
A. She had a severe injury to her left hind leg.
Q. How many other horses were in the barn?
A. There were a total of eleven horses in the barn, nine together in one pen and then two other horses each in their own individual pen.
Q. And was there any hay in the barn?
A. Yes. There were about six to eight bales of hay stored in the barn.
Q. Were they round bales or square bales?
A. No, they were square bales.
Q. And that was a good quality hay?
A. It appeared to be, yes.
Q. Okay. Was it then different than the type of hay that you saw out in the field?
A. Yes.
Q. Okay. Was the hay on the day that you were there accessible to the animals that were in the pens in the barn?
A. The animals in the pens in the barn did have hay.
Q. Okay. Looking at the horses that you observed on that day, was the condition of the horses consistent with having good quality of hay, good quality hay and water on a regular basis?
A. No.
Q. And why, why not?
A. Because of the body condition of the horses.
Q. Were there any other problems that you observed on the farm on that day?
A. Well, some of the horses appeared to have internal and external parasites.
Q. Could you describe what the signs are, what it was that led you to that conclusion that they had the internal and external parasites?
A. Well, some of them had very rough looking hair coats, distended abdomens, some of them had where hair was missing from their coat.
Q. Any other concerns?
A. No.
Q. Were there, I think you already discussed the, the debris.
A. Right.
Q. Okay. What about the gates that you saw in the pasture?
A. Some of the gates were just being held up with baler twine and were just rickety and could potentially fall over, they weren’t attached very well.
Q. Did you have occasion to see Matt Mercier on that day?
A. Yes.
Q. Okay. And did you have a conversation with him on that day?
A. No, I did not.
Q. Did you observe anybody else have a conversation with him?
A. Yes.
Q. And who was that?
A. Dr. Vicki Chickering.
Q. Okay. In your expert opinion, Doctor, were all of the horses on that farm failing to receive adequate shelter, food and water?
A. Yes.
Q. And do you have an opinion based on your expertise as to how longstanding this condition must have been?
A. I would say it had to be going on for months.
MS. LAMP: Thank you, Dr. Altemose. I don’t have any further questions.
THE COURT: Doctor, these gentlemen may have some questions for you. Mr. Dungan?
MR. DUNGAN: Thank you, Your Honor.
CROSS EXAMINATION (At 1:35 p.m.)
BY MR. DUNGAN:
Q. How did you end up getting involved in this case?
A. My job area is, includes
Q. Who contacted you I guess?
A. It would be my supervisor.
Q. Who is that?
A. Dr. Mark Remick.
Q. Do you know who contacted that person to get you involved?
A. No, I do not.
Q. All right.
THE COURT: How does Dr. Remick spell his last name?
THE WITNESS: R-e-m-i—c-k.
THE COURT: Thank you. Mr. Dungan?
BY MR. DUNGAN:
Q.
Dr. Remick contacts you and says you’re going to a farm in
A.
He contacted me and said that there was a case that most likely I would
be assigned to in
Q. Okay. And was that on the twentieth?
A. No.
Q. When was that?
A. That would have been on the sixteenth. March sixteenth.
Q. Oh, so you were first contacted on March sixteenth?
A. That’s right.
Q. By the boss, right?
A. Right.
Q. Who obviously had talked to somebody else.
A. Right.
Q. Do you know who he had talked to?
A. No, I don’t.
Q. All right. And then from the time you had this first knowledge on the sixteenth until the twentieth, what happens in between those days until you actually get down here?
A. Well, later on the sixteenth when I checked my email, then there was email information with the address and other contact phone numbers for the Animal Control officers and on Monday we contacted Animal Control to set up a time to go out to the farm.
Q. And March twentieth was actually a Monday?
A. No. That was a Tuesday.
Q. Okay. So set up a time Monday to go down to the farm on Tuesday.
A. On Tuesday, right.
Q. Okay. When you had that contact with Animal Control on Monday, was that by telephone?
A. Yes.
Q. And you talked to them personally?
A. I talked to Officer Dunlap.
Q. Okay. What information were you given about what this was going to be about?
A. That there was a horse facility that they would like us to evaluate the condition of the horses.
Q. That’s it?
A. Pardon me?
Q. That’s it? No other details?
A. Just that they had been out to the facility and wanted some extra input.
Q. About what?
A. About the condition of the animals and the facility.
Q. Okay. Did they say what input they had had so far?
A. Just that they had been out, the Animal Control officers.
Q. Didn’t describe to you what to expect to see out there?
A. No. They mentioned that some of the horses appeared to be in bad shape and the facility was not in great condition either.
Q. Okay. So you had a little bit of an idea what you were getting into before you got there.
A. A little bit.
Q. All right. So sixty-nine total live horses. Right?
A. Correct.
Q. And when you get down there there’s eleven housed in the barn and fifty-eight that are outside.
A. Right.
Q. First ones that you looked at were three that were kept in a pen west of the barn.
A. Right.
Q. And those were the three that had the body condition score of one.
A. Right.
Q. That’s the worst.
A. Correct.
Q. Other than dead I suppose.
A. Right.
Q. Right. And nine’s real fat.
A. Right.
Q. All right. And then is four or five what’s considered ideal?
A. The body condition score that I use, four would be considered ideal.
Q. Okay. So we don’t want horses at nines.
A. Right.
Q. All right. Did you do an examination of the three horses that had a body condition score of one to perhaps determine how it is they had gotten that way?
A. No, I did not.
Q. All right. Why not?
A. Our purpose was just to do a general evaluation of the facilities and the horses, not to do specific exams of individual animals.
Q. Okay. So however they got that way, you can’t help us with that.
A. No, I can’t.
Q. Okay. You did note that water and good quality hay was present in that pen. Correct?
A. Yes.
Q. Then there was another group of approximately eight to ten horses that you looked at next?
A. Well, no. We went to the pasture area where the forty-nine horses were after we walked past the pen where the three horses were.
Q. Okay. At some point in time though, you did get to the group of eight to ten horses.
A. The eight to ten with body condition scores of two to three, that would be overall throughout the rest of the animals that we looked at.
Q. Oh, all right, okay. Were those essentially the weanlings as you remember?
A. Yes. And there were probably one or two others that would have been in the bigger group of forty-nine.
Q. Okay. So out of the sixty-nine horses we’ve got three of them with a body condition score of one. Right?
A. Right.
Q. And we’ve got eight to ten that are somewhere between a two and a three.
A. Right.
Q. All right. And then the rest of them are four to five.
A. Right.
Q. And four to five is about perfect.
A. It’s at ideal.
Q. Right where you want them. Okay.
THE COURT: Five is too?
THE WITNESS: Five would be a little bit more condition than ideal and that’s considered a moderate condition on this chart.
BY MR. DUNGAN:
Q. Body condition score of five is probably to you and me we’ve got to lose five or ten pounds.
A. Well, it would be a little bit more condition than ideal.
Q. Okay, all right. Now, you had examined a paint mare that had foaled recently?
A. We saw her in the pasture.
Q. Okay. Did she have any medical issues that needed to be attended to immediately?
A. She appeared to. She had blood on her tail and on her hind quarters.
Q. Which would be consistent with just having either given birth or having a miscarriage, wouldn’t it?
A. It could be that or could have been something other than that. Just seeing the blood, we didn’t know.
Q. Okay. So the only thing that concerned you was the sight of the blood on her.
A. Well, no. She was standing in such a manner that she didn’t appear that she was feeling very well.
Q. Which would also be consistent with a mare that had just given birth or had a miscarriage too, right?
A. It could be, right.
Q. Okay. But you didn’t examine to find out why she was bleeding or--
A. No.
Q. -–why she was standing the way she was standing?
A. No, we didn’t.
Q. The foal that you found, I believe you testified you couldn’t tell us if that was a live birth or not.
A. Right.
Q. Which means it could have been-—do they call it abortion or a mistrial(sic) if they don’t go full term? What’s the term for a horse?
A. Well, an abortion would be spontaneously expelling the fetus. Not knowing when her due date was…
Q. That can happen.
A. Right.
Q. Even if there’s no torture, abuse or neglect involved, that can happen?
A. Right.
Q. All right. You found round bales of hay present, partially eaten. You didn’t seem too thrilled about the quality of those.
A. Right.
Q. All right. Now, as far as the food issue. What time do you get to this farm?
A. We got there early afternoon.
Q. And how long do you stay, total?
A. Oh, several hours.
Q. Okay. So you, you’d never been to that farm before.
A. No.
Q. Haven’t been back since.
A. Right.
Q. So you’ve got like one three hour window snapshot of that farm.
A. Right.
Q. In order to give us your opinions here today.
A. Right.
Q. And as far as food is concerned on that property, if somebody were showing up every morning between seven and nine thirty in the morning to put out hay and put out water, that didn’t happen at a time when you were there, right?
A. I’m sorry, say that again?
Q. The morning of the twentieth.
A. Right.
Q. If somebody came out with hay and water for all the horses between seven and nine thirty in the morning, you wouldn’t have been there to see that.
A. That’s right.
Q. And if they were coming back that evening to do the same thing, you wouldn’t have seen that either.
A. That’s right.
Q. Okay. I mean, would you agree with me, that the value of your opinion is a little bit limited in the sense that you only have a very narrow snapshot of how these horses are fed and watered?
A. It would be limited because I was just there for a short time.
Q. Okay, thank you. You had mentioned that there was a water tank with a layer of ice on top.
A. Right.
Q. It’s okay to have outdoor sources of water for horses, right?
A. Yes.
Q. And they don’t have to be heated?
A. Well, you would not want the ice to be so thick that they wouldn’t be able to drink from the tank, so you might need to heat it.
Q. Sure. But they can break through a thin layer with their noses, same as we could put our hand in it and break some ice up, right?
A. They could.
Q. Okay. So simply because there’s a thin layer of ice on top doesn’t mean that the horse is not going to be able to get the water.
A. Not the thin layer that we saw in this tank.
Q. You thought this one was too thick for that?
A. No. They could have broken the ice on this tank.
Q. Oh, they could have.
A. Yes.
Q. Okay, thank you. You had mentioned too that it appeared to you based on I guess some tracks that you saw in going around by the, the stream, that the horses had been drinking from the stream?
A. Well, the tracks near the stream led me to believe that they had been there and could have been drinking.
Q. Is drinking from the stream, is that an okay source of water for horses?
A. It depends if the water is good quality.
Q. Okay. Do you know that water not to be of good quality?
A. I don’t know anything about the water.
Q. Okay. You found square bales of hay stored in the barn. Correct?
A. Yes.
Q. Sweet feed stored in an old chest freezer?
A. Yes.
Q. All eleven horses in the barn had good quality hay in their pens. Correct?
A. Yes.
Q. All right. You had given some general observations too that a number of these horses had signs of internal and external parasites, right?
A. Right.
Q. The external parasites we essentially refer to as lice?
A. Right.
Q. And horses get lice.
A. Yes.
Q. And there’s easy treatments for that that are available?
A. There are treatments available.
Q. Like a lice powder or something?
A. Right.
Q. I mean, is that something that horse owners can expect to have to do from time to time?
A. Yes.
Q. I mean, no matter how hard you try, at some point you’re going to have a lice issue with a horse. True?
A. Well--
Q. I mean, I guess if you doused them with lice powder every day you might not, but I guess asking you a better question. Having a lice issue doesn’t necessarily mean torture, abuse and neglect.
A. It could.
Q. Depending on the severity, right?
A. It could be a neglect issue.
Q. Okay. Depending on how severe it is?
A. Well, depending if they have it or not. Depending on other circumstances.
Q. The internal parasites would be worms?
A. Right.
Q. And again, is it at all unusual for a horse to have worms?
A. No.
Q. Is that a constant battle, de-worming horses?
A. It is, yes.
Q. Something that always has to be done.
A. Right.
Q. You had noted too that hazards were present which could cause injury to horses.
A. Right.
Q. Boards and nails and things like that.
A. Right.
Q. Did you observe any horses that had injuries that was caused by that kind of debris?
A. I couldn’t say for sure whether the horses had injuries from that debris or not.
Q. Did you observe injuries?
A. The bay mare that was housed in the barn in the pen of nine had an injury to its left hind leg.
Q. That’s the one with the real bad leg wound.
A. Yes.
Q. All right. What about other injuries other than his?
A. That could have been caused by the debris?
Q. Yeah.
A. Or just in general?
Q. By debris.
A. I did not, no.
Q. Okay. Your ultimate opinion was that four horses needed immediate vet care. Correct?
A. Right.
Q. And that would be the three with the BCS of one.
A. Right.
Q. What is it that you wanted or were recommending a vet to do for them?
A. To give them a thorough physical exam to try and determine why they have a body condition score of one and then pursue appropriate treatment.
Q. And then obviously the horse with the hind leg injury with the open wound needed treatment too.
A. Yes.
Q. Now, how detailed of an examination did you make of that particular wound?
A. Just visually looked at the horse and its leg.
Q. I’m not trying to be picky with you, but are we talking like down on your knees, face six inches away from it, or….
A. No.
Q. How close did you get to it?
A. From outside the pen that they were in I was probably, oh, ten feet away.
Q. Okay. Do you think, was that adequate enough for you to see it?
A. To see it, yes.
Q. Did you see any wire wrapped around it?
A. No, I did not.
Q. All right. Were you close enough to see something like that?
A. Depending if the wire would have been deep within the wound, I probably couldn’t have seen it and maybe couldn’t have seen it had I been within six inches of it. If it was deep in the tissue.
Q. Oh, I agree. But if it was outside the wound, would you have seen it?
A. I think I could have, yes.
Q. But there was nothing there for you to see.
A. Not that I saw.
Q. All right. Now, if I got my math right here, out of the sixty-nine total horses we got three with a BCS of one, eight to ten are at a BCS two to three. Say that’s thirteen at the most. That would leave fifty-six of the horses with an appropriate body condition score.
A. Yes.
Q. Of four to five.
A. Yes.
Q. And this was on March twentieth, 2007.
A. Right.
Q. All right. So if another doctor came out seven days later and indicated that seventy percent of the horses were below acceptable weight, would you agree with that or disagree with that?
A. I could agree with that.
Q. Based on what math?
A. Well, based on how they did the body condition scoring.
Q. Are you competent you did the body conditioning scoring correctly?
A. Yes.
MR. DUNGAN: Okay, all right, thank you. I have no further questions, Your Honor.
MR. HURST: Just briefly, Your Honor.
CROSS-EXAMINATION(At 1:51 p.m.)
BY MR. HURST:
Q. Dr. Altemose, you testified you’ve got fourteen years of experience in the veterinarian field. Is that correct?
A. That’s right.
Q.
And the last six years have been as a field veterinarian with the
Department of Agriculture in the state of
A. Yes.
Q. So that means you must have spent eight years in private practice.
A. Right.
Q.
And three to four of those years were in
A. Right.
Q. And you stated that it was there that you treated ten to twelve horses.
A. Right.
Q. What kind of horses were you treating and what were you treating them for?
A. It would be mostly backyard facilities. Maybe people who had one or two horses, vaccinations, that type of thing.
Q. So not horse herd management situations or ranches or farms with large numbers of horses.
A. No.
Q.
And the
A. That’s right.
Q. Because that was just a small animal clinic. Is that correct?
A. That’s right.
Q. All right. And you stated that you were first contacted by your supervisor on March sixteenth of 2007. Is that correct?
A. Yes.
Q. Did he contact you by phone or email or how did he get in touch with you?
A. He called me by phone initially.
Q. Okay. And then you said there was a follow-up contact later on that day from the Jackson County Animal Control. Is that correct?
A. No. That is not correct. Later that day I got an email when I got home and checked my email, there was an email.
Q. So later that day on March sixteenth, 2007, you got an email when you got home from Jackson County Animal Control.
A. No. From our office giving me the assignment, the contact phone numbers and information.
Q. All right. And did you preserve that email or is it still on your computer?
A. I do not know if it’s still on my computer.
Q.
But if it was there you could print it off and provide it to the
prosecuting attorney of
A. Yes.
Q. And you would do so if I asked you to do so?
A. Yes.
Q. May I ask you to do so?
A. Sure.
Q. Thank you very much. Now, you stated that on March twentieth, 2007, one of your recommendations was a thorough physical examination of those four horses. Correct?
A. I’m sorry. Could you repeat that?
Q. One of your recommendations on, as a result of your visit on March twentieth, 2007, was that there be a thorough physical examination of those four horses, the three with the BCS of one and the horse with the, with the cut on the leg.
A. I believe the recommendation was that they receive immediate veterinarian attention and that should include a thorough physical exam.
Q. Do you know whether or not a thorough physical exam of those four horses was ever conducted?
A. I don’t know.
Q. Would it have been your understanding when you were there on March twentieth making your recommendations that a thorough physical examination of those four horses would be done?
A. That was my understanding.
Q. And you state there was no grass covering the ground when you were out there?
A. Not any new grass.
Q. Okay. And on March twentieth of ’07, given the weather of that particular period in time in history, would that have been unusual?
A. No.
MR. HURST: Okay, thank you very much. I have no further questions.
THE COURT: Miss Lamp?
MS. LAMP: Thank you.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION(At 1:54 p.m.)
BY MS. LAMP:
Q. Dr. Altemose, did you touch any of the horses in the course of your examination?
A. No.
Q. And let me ask you if there is some degree of objectivity in determining what the BCS is?
A. Yes, there is.
Q. Okay. Now, Dr. Altemose, you talked about the thin ice on that water tank. Do you recall that?
A. Yes.
Q. Okay. And you testified that of course the horse could, it was thin enough that the horse could break the ice to drink it. Is that correct?
A. Right.
Q. The fact that the ice was not broken, did that tell you anything?
A. It appeared that they were not using that tank to drink, since the ice was not broken.
Q. And the body of water that ran through the back part of the pasture that you talked about. Were you able to, can you tell if that’s a stream or a ditch or what it really is? If you know.
A. I don’t really know if it’s a stream or a ditch.
Q. Could it be either one?
A. Could be.
Q.
Did the level of lice infestation that you observed on the farm at, in
A. Yes.
Q. And why would you say that?
A. Because it appeared that there were many horses that had lice.
Q. Had you seen an infestation like that previously?
A. No.
Q. And while you were only there for a period of hours, if I understood your testimony this had to have occurred over a period of months to get to this point.
A. Yes.
Q. So the snapshot reflected more than just the hours of time that you were there. Is that correct?
A. That’s right.
MS. LAMP: Thank you, Doctor. I have nothing further.
THE COURT: Mr. Dungan? Mr. Hurst?
MR. HURST: Just briefly, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Sure.
RECROSS-EXAMINATION (at 1:56 p.m.)
BY MR. HURST:
Q. You testified that you had not seen that level of lice infestation at a horse ranch previously?
A. Right.
Q.
During your six years with the state of
A. Right.
Q. And how many horse ranches have you examined in that six year period?
A. None.
Q. So it would make sense that you’d not seen that level of lice infestation if this was the first horse ranch you had examined.
A. Right.
Q. Are you familiar with an organization named Leelanau Horse Rescue?
A. I have heard of it.
Q. Okay. Do you know anything about it?
A. Not really.
Q. Do you know anybody who is part of that organization?
A. No.
Q. And are you a member of that organization?
A. No, I’m not.
MR. HURST: Thank you very much, Doctor.
THE COURT: Mr. Dungan?
MR. DUNGAN: Nothing.
THE COURT: Miss Lamp?
MS. LAMP: Nothing, Your Honor.
THE COURT: When you say the level of lice that you saw here you hadn’t seen before it’s because you’d never seen it before.
THE WITNESS: Right.
THE COURT: It wasn’t that it—-how do you determine that it’s a level of neglect then?
THE WITNESS: Well, just with the number of horses that were involved. It didn’t appear that anything was being done to remedy the situation.
THE COURT: With the lice?
THE WITNESS: Right.
THE COURT: Okay. Thank you, Doctor.
MS. LAMP: I have one follow-up question, Your Honor, if I may.
THE COURT: Yes.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION (At 1:57 p.m.)
BY MS. LAMP:
Q. If there had been something being done to treat the lice, what type of evidence do you think you would have seen of that?
A. Well, it’s possible we would have seen some type of product there that they may, that maybe they were using.
Q. And you didn’t see anything.
A. I did not.
Q. Okay. And didn’t see any sign on the horses that they had been being treated?
A. No.
MS. LAMP: Okay. Nothing further.
THE COURT: Okay. May the doctor be excused?
MS. LAMP: Yes, please, Your Honor.
MR. HURST: Yes, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Okay, Doctor. Thank you very much. Watch your step going down and you’re excused.
Thanks for coming in.
(At 1:58 p.m. witness excused)